SHARE:

Hodge-podge…

This thought is based on the idea that the time line we are witnessing off island now is the FIRST and ORIGINAL time line of the Lost characters…making the one we saw… a time line possibly decided by them in some self-sacrificial manner…allowing themselves to be encompassed by the “darkside” in favor of allowing a victory of the “light”. In simple words…taking MIBs offer and chasing their happiness…Meaning I think the off island time line is what happens if MIB wins…do I believe any of what im about to say? Im not really sure…This is about as “real” as I think this reality gets…

The reason I say that the reality is not real on so many other posts, is not because I think they are in strapped to a machine or anything like that… it was seeming what MIBs offer gave to the Losties, right? Its what happened if he won? I propose if the time line off island we are seeing is real then it is what originally happened, and the timeline we saw from the beginning was from Jacob touching people and changing the original timeline…making the one we have been seeing from the beginning, the “alternate” one. But if Jacob influenced one to create an alternate timeline, then MIB influenced that one to make it an alternate timeline as well…making them both real to the characters who were on the island, but only one is real to the people off island…they are not real…they are merely places for Jacob and possibly MIB to find lab rats or game pieces for their argument.

Why isnt this the happy ending???
This is not a flash forward, it is a flash sideways…it doesnt make sense for them to call it “sideways” and have it be the “future”.

So now that I have the attention of the people that think its real, let me ask this question…if its real…and its sideways and not forward…and its 2004 off island…how are they still on the island in 2007?
Because we are seeing events take place off island, that in my opinion on examining details and adding speculation as I have done an several posts, that the two time lines in the 2004 era of the show are and have been running parallel..we just dont see it in that linear fashion…we have seen the one get us to where we are, now we must see the other timeline that we created get us to the very same place…the island in 2007…and what better way to battle a new time period “created by MIB…let Jacob run amok…

It would be fun if we started to see certain things that people on island remember happen off island, such as Dogen and his sons story happen NOW off island. This to me could be a way of showing that Jacob is off island too..and still as ‘touching’ as he ever was. We cannot continue to think of time being linear…they are messing with us…the people on the island dont just come from one time period, or time line, or reality…they come from many to eventually meet on island in the manner in which we have seen at the same moment…not time, time is irrelevant…MIB thinks he won by creating this “alternate timeline” if its true, then I say its just the progress Jacob needed to prove him wrong.

This could also mean that the touches we see, have in some manner not occurred in terms of “linear time”…but still occurred and experienced by certain individuals who were involved, contacted, or ‘touched’ by someone from the future,other time line, reality, or life…ensuring their fate as being a part of that future/timeperiod/reality/life. There is nothing magical or protective about them other than confirming these individuals to be almost bonded to a part of a certain time period/reality/other life that they originally were not…protecting them only until the time comes in which they are needed…whether a few days before a flight, a few years after a surgery, many years into your childhood…or so long ago that your body is able to become invincible due to the duration of your gift/curse…

This plays into what I think is possibly going on between Jacob and MIB as well…
A long time ago MIB and Jacob were on the island…something happened in which MIB conscious traveled out of his on island body and into his past self, he changes things in a manner in which he was horribly/fatally wounded.
At the last second before his death, his conscious travels back to his future and present self…which doesnt exist anymore because he broke the rules and died in his past…judging by how the game is going now, possibly from a self inflicted wound attempting to “find a loophole” (both literally and metaphorically)…

Regardless, his current state of instability and the ability itself of changing forms could have something to do with this type of scenario. He doesnt have a physical existence anymore, but like John told Jack in LAX, the body was Lost…but not the person.

Jacob takes control of the situation in a manner that is not only counteractive to MIBs situation, but plays a fun role of opposite in a “black and white” world…by going to the future…and touching the “candidates” one by one, or in the case of Sun and Jin, two by two touches, meaning to me…they are both candidates…and like the rest, unable to die…possibly from CHOICES THAT THEY MAKE, which is why the power of persuasion and influence mean so much to Jacob and MIB.

His touches confirm that in the future the Losties will play a part, whether they want to or not…yes, Richard Alpert is now officially a Lostie and not an Other in my book.

I believe MIBs home is nothing more than returning his conscious, via reincarnation, to its original home…his body. And have his chance at being what he told Sawyer he once was, a man…and possibly longing for his Lost love, willing to go through anyone or anything to get it…even if it means a dark path.

I believe that he is experiencing everything that the Losties have, pain, sorrow, regret, and longs for the same goal…redemption…another chance. The problem is, he is going about it the wrong way. He is willing to fight, destroy, and corrupt everything himself…making him the one who the whole thing may be about. All this time and he still doesnt get it…

Maybe MIB is the first on Jacobs list, bound to the island with no say in the matter…chosen as a candidate for being the islands protector just like everybody else, and cannot escape even in death…because he has nothing left to lose. Jacob intends on showing him the error of his ways by utilizing the Losties as players in his own little role playing game.

They all must find the correct path, some with help, others by sitting and staring at the ocean for a while…then making their own choice without deceit. By being allowed to make their own choices, and not be controlled by fate other than Jacobs touch, they remain “protected”. Once they sway to the persuasion or manipulation of MIB, they have been “infected”…”corrupted” and are ready to “fight” beside MIB in effort to “destroy” the island and everything on it for the simple reason of full-filling their own desires…they are “Lost”… and the ones who have found their own way must try to once again “fix” things…the question is…Is Jacob the one who originally broke what now needs fixed?
And what needs fixed most…is the people.
Thank you for your time…

Share with fellow Losties

Written by

A.E.S.

Abbot Enheduanna Schwarzschild

42 thoughts on “Hodge-podge…

  1. all the timelines are really confusing LOL.

    the best explanation I’ve read involved the incident as we seen at the end of season 5 causing the possibilities of duplicate losties, kinda like the rabbit in the orientation film. i can’t explain it very well and i can’t find the original theory posted by someone else, but i’m sure i read it.

    basically we are not see an alt timeline at all. we are simply seeing two versions of the same people, one off island one on.

  2. Good stuff A.E.S!

    I really like the idea of MIBs home simply being his body, i never thought about that and it would make alot of sense.
    Hes go through all of this so he can be a man again, which could involve turning back the clock and making it so he never came to the island in the first place.

    I like your first view of if the parallel is real, as thats what i thought (now i just don’t know). I thought it might be a previous timeline before the losties were ‘chosen’ and i thought we’d see how and why they were chosen.
    My thoughts were that the reason why things were so much better in that reality, jack having a kid, Lockes relationship with his father etc was because this was a reality where the island/Jacob had no influence on them.

    In the main timeline the losties had to feel pain for the greater good, and less motivation to get back to their lives in the outside world, one example would be Jacobs encounter with Sayid as Nadia is killed.

    I am coming round to your idea that its not that ‘real’ afterall, but now its down to the writers to explain that in an understandable fashion. Is it happening as we see it? Is it before? Is it after? (eyes shoot out of skull)

  3. Just a couple more points i’m thinking of

    If we look at the so called “new” timeline, what are we really seeing? It would appear that this version of reality should be the real timeline if the Losties never did crash to create the incident (tipping point that saved the Island).

    So, if they were not doing all that time travel to actually detonate the bomb what would happen? Maybe the plane would never have split up and crashed as we seen in the first episode of the season and something else caused the Island to sink.

    Evidence of such a plot is Ben in the “new” timeline where he was never shot on the Island and his dad left the Island maybe by choice maybe by evacuation caused by the “real” incident. Basically Sayid never travelled back in time to shoot Ben, and neither did the other Losties to detonate the bomb, etc. So when Juliet says it worked, maybe that was what she meant, they never existed on the Island in the end so their lives just went back to normal.

  4. You did it again, AES! Another theory which I both understand and don’t understand at the same time. 😉

    To put it like Yojimbo; I have no idea what you’re talking about. But I have a vague idea of it.

    For example, I get the point about the sideways timeline being the original one, and the flashback (season 1) timeline being the one where Jacob interferes (correct?).
    But I’m completely lost on the part about (some) timelines being real or not?

    Like in your previous posts, I think you are the closest to the whole timelines/reality stuff of all on this site, but understanding your theory fully is quite hard for me lol. Maybe that’s also because isn’t exactly an easy subject.

    So, good thoughts!

  5. I really like your idea about MIB being a lost soul without a body.This is the closest to accurate as anyone has been yet.Most people I don’t think get that if you were to travel back in time and your past self was killed you would simply not exist anymore.This would have to mean that his body is still alive somewhere but not inhabited by his soul.Now the same note theoretically you could be killed while time traveling in the past without any change,except you would never arrive back in the present.We could be seeing a version of the losties lives without coming to the island if and i think only if something was done to change their arrival.BUT,it would have to be changed by someone other than the losties.Because they could not change the past directly, or without influence ,without coming to island initially.So maybe that might explain why we have’nt seen Desmond since the plane.

  6. Shep, you and I have similar ideas towards the shows story, we just show them in different ways (you with MIB and me with Jacob, off island)…Im going to lookinto some of your other theories and see what else we have in common in regards to thoughts…

    Jimbo and whoever else, Ill try and “dumb it down” for you a little later…it (my theory) is confusing, as it and the show is meant to be, hence both titles…

    Username, you right about something else sinking the island…and its name rhymes with “shemesis”…

    Stone, thank you for the nice comments even though you dont fully understand it…truth is, I dont either and thats why I wrote a theory called “Hodgepodge”…

    Like I told Yojimbo, Ill try and clear it up a little more later…

    Thanks for the comments all…in regards to questions, specific ones are easier for me to explain, as Stone asked about timelines “not being real”…I will try and explain more in depth and in simple terms later…

    Good additions, and although confusing, I think it may be on the right path…

  7. “This would have to mean that his body is still alive somewhere but not inhabited by his soul.”

    I don’t know why you say so, foreverpuzzled. As far as I am concerned, there is nothing to back up the statement that a body and a soul can be separated, or that there is even such a thing as a soul for that matter. In any case, I seriously doubt that time travel would have that kind of effect. But in the Lost universe, anything is possble of course.

  8. I like where this theory goes with MIB hating what Jacob has created with his timeline, but what if MIB was the original Jacob and he picked Jacob as his replacement only to find out what he did with it was test humans? He hates it now and has decided to destroy the man and leave.

    I was also thinking along the lines that if Locke from the sideways timeline got to the Island somehow, would he not be pissed off that Smokey was using his body?

    That’s where this theory takes me. Maybe I’ll poste a question on this because it’s intriguing. Good post.

  9. That’d be good. Your theories are always so packed full of full-on ideas that I can tell are bouncing around in your brain, but read like random thoughts. Very hard to visualise them as ever coming to fruition in the conext of a TV narrative ATM. I’d really look forward to a rearticulation of the upshot of what you see as your main points and how it’d work.

  10. Ok…boiled down…

    I dont think the off island timelines are necessarily real…The simplest way to put it, unless Jacobs touch has nothing to do with certain people not dying, he manipulated it by protecting those he touched…but I dont see it as full on manipulation, I see it as protecting those who he touched from the influence of the dark side. There are many that have tried, and one by one failed…maybe they needed suicide due to previous manipulation by MIB causing the thoughts and intentions from other time lines influence their actions regarding self harm…meaning they simply are not supposed to die, and Jacob is only allowing the hand of fate to continue untouched by MIB… I am still struggling on a more clear explanation of this…I know the idea, its hard to understand.

    There is no simple way to explain it…maybe just breaking up the points for those who are confused by my hodgepodge…

    -The timelines are not real off island, they are both manipulated in some way by either Jacob or MIB…

    -MIB conscious traveled to the past and died, possibly killing himself trying to find his literal and metaphorical loophole, and at the last moment before dying flashed back to the future, but with no body due to changing the past…with the islands properties, and the “hand” of possibly Jacob MIB was changed into the monster we know him as today…

    -MIBs home is his real self, what he doesnt understand is, that he is going about it the wrong way, and until he strays from the path of darkness, he can never get “home”… anything he finds resembling it in that manner will most likely turn out bad for him, just like it will the losties if they indeed took his offer, which it appears at least some did.
    This should cause them to return to a past version of their selves, (for MIB possibly a scene from the beach or even Black Rock…and for the losties possibly the pilot scene, yes Im still hanging on to it)
    From there, they can have a chance to know the options available, and what the outcome is…and have the choice of which path to take…

    -Jacobs touch is nothing more than solidifying someones role in another time, place, life,or reality…it protects them from influence once until they do what they are ‘supposed’ to do by the laws of either god or the universe…Im not getting into that right now…

    -Once they die, they can then be infected, manipulated, and used by MIB…

    -Jacob wanted MIB to do what he is doing, it is the only way for him to have gotten everyone from his list to the island. Both timelines were meant to rise, and then converge…on the island.

    He then went to the different timeperiods/lines and touched certain individuals to ensure their presence when necessary on island…I think we will see the story Dogen told play out from this perspective, and see a different line of characters stories as they are taken to the island…Ilana could also be in the same category.

    -The island is a place where timelines meet…they are taken from a simple linear form to a constant synchronized pattern of events occurring throughout history, simultaneously…Jacob can enter wherever he wants and choose people to be a part of the only “real” reality in my eyes…the island.

    -Why its not a happy ending…its not and ending or “forward”…its “sideways”!!!
    It doesnt make sense for it to be the end…otherwise it would have been called a flash forward… it will lead back to the island connecting with the current scenario for some.

    – I also ask a question to the people who think its real and possibly the end…If its sideways, not forward, and they are on the island in 2007…how can it be sunk in 2004?
    …because its not the end, and its no more real than the time period it is “alternate/parallel” from…both are not real, they are past(s), manipulated and created by actions of Jacob in the original, and MIB in the new one.

    -And while Im throwing out my thoughts here, just to make sure Im off the fence and going against many that I have agreed with on the show…I do believe Jacob is the good guy and MIB is the bad guy…for as much as we can label Jacob and MIB, good or bad. I think MIB is a liar and manipulator, buying the “souls” of the losties for eternity. Using what they want most to get what he wants most…To go home.
    I have more to add to Jacob and MIBs “sides”, but that is for another time…

    Honestly, there is no way to boil down my thoughts without the reasoning behind them, otherwise they are just random, meaningless possibilities, which in reality, all theories are until the answer is given…so thats about as boiled down as I can get.

    I am more than willing to answer any questions, whether they are in agreement or not…I dont really care at this point…Ill take a good beating to get some life back on this site…its too slow for the time of year it is in the lost universe…

    I do apologize for the way I transfer my thoughts Yojimbo. I do not carry the articulation of say…a college professor, but my words seem understood by many, and have been for quite some time…so I will continue to convey my thoughts in the manner that has brought me what I feel is success as a theorist in terms of communicating with the reader.

    Im not writing a research paper or even a theory most of the time…Im simply speaking to anyone who listens. Which is why I or almost anyone else doesnt ever list references for the average theory in case anyone is wondering.
    My thought changes drastically, as I am willing to adapt to change…sometimes not conveyed in the most ‘understandable’ fashion…but most people either hate my theories for the way I write, and the unwillingness to be swayed from what I believe…or like them for the exact opposite reasons…I could care less at this point…

    As every theory I write is not the easiest to understand, I choose to sometimes allow the reader to draw their own conclusion on what I am getting at, even though most of the time I do spell it out.

    I also choose to write some thoughts out of order on purpose, and sometimes I just get lost in my own thoughts. I usually get my point across to most either way.

    And I am not directing any agression or anything like that at you or anyone else, so please nobody feel offended. Im simply speaking my mind in my comment, its anyones choice to read it.

    Again, direct questions are the easiest way to understand…Im more than willing to give my best answer, and tell what I think the likeliness of it coming true.

    TV narrative ATM…I think I have found my calling…

  11. Ilie, I do agree with you about the body not being alive somewhere, and to follow the line of the show, lets say conscious instead of soul for the time being…
    A giant pillar of smoke that can take dead peoples forms…I label that in the category of “anything is possible on Lost”, and agree, there may be a much simpler explanation…this just follows an old line of thinking I had about Jacob, and my recent thoughts on reincarnation (which does involve the soul).

    I agree its a long shot…but makes some stupid sense in the lost universe.

  12. Allgoodthings…I completely understand all of your questions. I do have some speculative ideas that actually coincide with all of your questions…I should post it later this week…good thoughts, thanks for the comment…

  13. Puzzled…great thoughts on Des…I agree he is going to play a part in the change of the island…due to his “special ability” and what I think is coming for him in a more physical manner, I definitely think he is a huge role in causing change on the island…maybe the only one.
    Thanks for the comment….

  14. Allright AES, I read this earlier today but didn’t have the time to comment then. I just reread it now along with your most recent comments and some things were clarified for me.

    First, I like your idea of Smokey’s mind being separated from his body. There was a time I thought that something similar was going on and that his mind was trapped in the cabin while his ‘body’ in the form of smoke was roaming the island.

    I also really like the idea of all times converging on the Island. I had a thought once that the Island actually regulated time for the rest of the planet and the FDW was actually the regulator for the speed of the pendulum that the Island was.

    Now as for the timelines being real or not. I firmly believe they are both real and valid timelines. IMO ‘alt’ timeline has always existed and the explosion of Jughead created a conduit for consciousness to leak through. Another possibility is that Jacob’s touch set up the conduit and Jughead acted as a catalyst that triggered the leaking.

    As for the ‘flashsideways’ I simply view them as a scene change and narrative device in the same vain as the flasahbacks and flash forwards. The only difference is that this jump in the narrative is taking place physically in a different universe. The best way I can think to illustrate my way of thinking here is to remind you of how the narrative of the Illuminatus trilogy is. My views on this are very Discordian.

    However, my difference in opinion with you about the reality of the timelines doesn’t invalidate your theory. In fact I think the realities being real would make your theory even more interesting.

    A very good read and thoroughly enjoyable as usual AES.

  15. Hi Achalli, glad you like the smokie/MIB seperation idea, and the timelines convergence on island idea…

    lol, as for the timelines being real…I just find it hard to believe that both timelines are real in terms of real to the outside world…some people that died exist, and some people that exist…died…I dont think its supposed to be that way, and it could possibly do harm in a way of thinking ripping time in two…The simple act of Jacob or anyone entering and manipulating or even helping the outcome for reasons of good…is wrong…or is it?
    Thats a premature question without knowing Jacobs true intentions I guess…

    I get what you bring up about Illuminatus, but how many times did a character experience something…without actually going anywhere? It was a real experiance to them…but to the rest of the world nothing happened. I would like to be able to write a theory and just post the big discordian “yin-yang” symbol with no explanation at all…

    If its real so be it, its still a creation of MIB or Jacob from the one we saw…or vice versa. If its real, and for some reason sideways means forward, then from my beliefs, it is a happy ending that is caused by everyone abandoning MIB, and going into the light. Giving up what they truly desire for the simple act of being a good person and putting others before themselves…a reward by Jacob for their scrifice and abandonment of MIB…but I doubt any of that and believe its just a parallel timeline created by MIB that will converge with the other parallel timeline from the beginning of the show. The will merge with what is the real timeline on Lost, the 2007 on island timeline…Im done talking about this because im tired of typing “timeline”…

    Good comment on this Achalli…I knew you were going to nail me on the timelines being not real, Ill go down in flames with this one…
    ;]
    I was hoping you would appreciate the ‘Discordian’ title…confusion, chaos, and disorder…Everything happens for a reason right?

  16. I agree there is something fishy about the sideways time-line/universe but it is very hard to put your finger on what it could be.I like this quote from Robert Anton Wilson’s Historical Illuminatis Chronicles.
    “All phenomena are real in some sense, unreal in some sense, meaningless in some sense, real and meaningless in some sense, unreal and meaningless in some sense, and real and unreal and meaningless in some sense.”

    I don’t about the meaningless part but if the Losties are at least consciously experiencing the off island time it is to a certain extent real whether it is happening in what we call space-time or not. It seems to be the place where their character is clarified. Taking it a step further maybe it was created for just that purpose. Even if they aren’t experiencing it consciously but the clarification of purpose is transferred to their island consciousness it is still serving as a type of reality for them. They can rise OR sink there and converge with their self as we have known them for the past five seasons.

  17. hey ilieintheshadow…. the reason why I used the word soul is because that is what I personally believe.It was not meant to offend and I agree with A.E.S. that the word conscious would be a better term.Sometimes when you are writting your opinion ,like I was ,your personal beliefs show through.As for my statement about his body being alive somewhere was a response to A.E.S. syaing that he traveled back in time and was either injured or killed.I personally believe a “consious” can’t exist in our world without a body.

  18. basically AES this is good. Perhaps what you are arguing is that as rational, logical thinkers we are trying to overcomplicate to simplify. EG creating linear time travel models, alternate realities etc.

    Time travel means you can do exactly that. TRAVEL through TIME. As a results we should not try to be too dismissive. however my only problem with this is that there would be no cause and effect linked to the past, present and future of the characters. So if something happens in a different world (Shrodingers cat or whatever the theory is) or in another time line, it does not have such direct importance. Which I think can not work.

    Was it no more important that Jack can not die just like Michael could not kill himself? After reflecting out into the ocea, he seems to have clicked that as Jacob has touched/chosen them, there is a reason that they are on the island. And rather than keep running pointlessly like headless chickens (aka Sawyer, Kate and to a lesser extent Ben) they need to embrace the events coming their way.

    A bit more like the early Locke before he was murdered and possessed. “Everything happens for a reason” on the island, and time travel is just the same.

  19. I guess I don’t really need to say it, but to get this straight: I don’t have a problem at all with your style of writing. It is unlike most other ones here and it’s partly because of your style that I enjoy reading your posts.

    About the ‘reality’ of the timelines:
    By ‘not real’ you just mean that Jacob and MIB have influenced (people from) the timeline?

    And you say in your comment that MIB wants to go home but is going the wrong way, so he can’t get home. But it seems like he is actually getting a big chance of going home, as we’ve seen (since Jacob is dead?), while he’s still going the wrong way..

    Do you mean that the Losties are having a chance at redemption, but to ‘fulfill’ that chance (or that destiny), they need to stay on the island? Or are you saying, that the island is the place where they can get redemption, and then ‘return home’, that is to their off island normal lives?

  20. Roland, good thoughts, and I know Achalli will appreciate that quote from R.A.W.

    Puzzled…I want to say soul…I MEAN “soul” not conscious…I just say conscious to avoid unnecessary debate at this point…but in believing in reincarnation and time travel on Lost…well, just believe me that I would say soul if it didnt cause such a stir…

    Nacho…When Jack was sitting with Richard and that dynamite, the scene screamed season one Lost…I thought the exact same thing.

    I like to over complicate…I do, I cant lie…but this time I wish I could explain my view of how time works on Lost…

    I do find the importance of action having consequence through different realities…and thats the fun part…the island is the place where a person has the chance of using the sub-conscious thought of two different realities…a place to connect and bring together the two “realities” to make one conscious thought regarding and understanding what they ahve learned in their other lives.

    Great thoughts everyone, again thank you all for the comments…

  21. Stone, Im saying that the island is their chance at real redemption…
    I believe that they are supposed to be on the island…and honestly…I dont think they are ever supposed to go home again.

    I knew it would be confusing, and for once actually didnt mean for that to be confusing. I think that off island is important to building the characters for their role on island…as much as I agrue “real or not”, its going to be pretty irrelevant in the long run, as I think once it converges, they will never leave the island again.
    My description of it as a happy ending is just playing along with the flow, and saying that if it is the end…which its not…that it is an ending that is given by Jacob and not MIB…they would just want us to think the other way.

    But I dont think its the end in any way. I think it is just another part of the story, and will explain again how they return, and will show possibly how others came to the island. I dont see a real happy ending in that manner.

    I also feel that although it appears MIB is going home, it will not be that easy…and even if he gets there…he is a part of this story now, and I feel he may have “followers” in his homecoming…

    MIB thinks finding his loophole is the way out…but as we saw the child with bloddy hands almost mock him…the loophole may not be the most effective way out of the situation. It is cheating whatever insane game they are playing, and although it appears to give him an advantage, it will never allow him to truly win, and go home.

    Great thoughts, and Im glad you enjoy my theories…thanks for the comments and I hope I answered your questions well enough…if not, kepp em coming…I want people to understand my view before agreeing or disagreeing…great thoughts and questions…

  22. Hi AES, I have read through your theory and all of the comments.

    Looking at the ‘literal’ meaning of the term ‘flash sideways’ is as follows:

    Flash means to appear or occur suddenly….to ‘reflect’. Sideways means, in a lateral direction….an ‘external’ view. This is how I look at the term and its function. The reason why this occurred is not necessary to understand the general meaning of what we are being shown.

    I will use the analogy that if we were to take a ‘road’ trip to another city, we might take the Highway or choose the ‘Scenic’ route. The experiences, views, etc., will be different, but ultimately you arrive at the same destination. Each route eventually must ‘merge’ at the conclusion of the journey, regardless of the road you took to arrive there.

    We still have to view that fate and destiny play a part in this story analogy.

    We have seen characters from Lost, past and present, alive and dead in the ‘flash sideways’. Logically, it makes sense that all of the characters will interact, albeit under different circumstances. I have to believe this is moving us towards a similar end that will culminate in some understanding of ‘the losties’ purpose, from their perspective and ours.

    It has meaning, and we cannot rule out that we may see and understand how other characters are/were implicated by the touch of Jacob. Considering that the journey isn’t over, I suspect we will learn much more in this regard.

    I have to believe that if Ben found redemption, that it is still available to anyone else. Ultimately, I see sacrifice for their beliefs as being something they will be prepared to make.

    Great thoughts and discussion!

  23. AES, actually a better book to use as an example is the Schrodinger’s Cat Trilogy. Each part of the trilogy takes place in a alternate universe and the third part skips from universe to universe in a similar matter to what we see on Lost.

    Roland, do you have the whole trilogy? I’ve git only the second book and have not been able to locate the otherparts. As for the quote, it’s basically saying that there is no correct way to look at something, only interpretations.

    Dabs, I loveyour analogy of a road trip. However, at this time I don’t see a need for the timelines to be merged. In my view they exist exclusive of each other, but communication between them may be possible.

  24. I own all three books. I bought two of them on Amazon. You might want to look there. RAW died before he finished the series but I still like reading them. I am much more familiar with them than any other books by Wilson. The rest of his books are on my find list for this summer.

  25. Glad I could help out stone, and honestly I thank you for your patience…

    Dabsi…love the trip analogy. I agree fully on Bens redemption. And I feel that the on island redemption outweighs the offisland redemption…

    I also love “Flash sideways = lateral reflection…great thoughts on the subject!

    Achalli…your take on the qoute…” there is no correct way to look at something, only interpretations”…brilliant…it is my point exactly with off island being real/not real…If there ends up being two different realities/universes/time lines/lives of people that merge into one entity of that person on the island…how do you define what is real and what is not…they are both real…they are experienced…and they are both the building blocks of the character…but in the end, its all going to be left to the decisions of the characters capable of identifying the different realities that have occurred, and choosing the one that they wish to ‘believe’ in…Did Jack have a kid, or is he not a father…does Jack decide this…will he realize, or will one day David walk up to Jack and say “Hi Dad” and Jack says “Who the hell are you?”…

    Roland, Im glad to hear you are a RAW fan. I have only read the Illumintus, but loved every mind numbing second of it…
    I love the qoute you present and love your interpretation of it more…nice wirk everyone…

  26. Roland, I suggest that you read the Illuminatus trilogy first. AES and myself have used it as a basis for understanding Lost many times. I’ve actually read that book five times now. After that you should read the Schrodinger’s Cat trilogy. It contains many of the same characters as Illuminatus and takes place in three different universes that have only one thing in common, and that thing hurts and disturbs me to think about it. Then there is Masks of the Illuminati Which features James Joyce and Albert Einstein playing detective and helping a Englishman solve a series of murders supposedly committed by a secret society that wants to drive the Englishman insane. They all have a massive head trip at the end and Alistair Crowley is in on the shanannigins also.

  27. I read the Iluminaus trilogy but only once and it was quite a few years ago. Almost all of his stuff is out of print but I got a couple of people at little used book stores keeping an out for me. I spent $70.00 each for the last two books of the Historical Illuminas and they were paperback!

  28. Youre not stepping on anything…I created the title hoping it would spawn this topic in the long run…So thank you…

    Achallis newest comment hit the nail on the head for a future theory from me…

    Very nice discussion everyone…

  29. I was thinking about the name of the Locke centered episode. The Substitute. It’s not an alternate time line where something has been changed but completely replaced. Some may say thats like splitting hairs but it does make a difference.

  30. AES, what are your thoughts on the H-bomb regarding your ideas about the sideways-flashes being the original timeline?

    Cause can’t we safely assume that the H-bomb at least had something to do with the flash sideways (season 5 ending with the white flash, season 6 starting with sideways-815 flight)..

  31. Which could probably mean that the H-bomb triggered the sideways-timeline…But if the sideways timeline was the original timeline of the losties…

    How can that be reconciled?

  32. By eliminating the competition, or Jacob if you will.

    no jacob = no influence = no island…the question still leaves us at is it for better or worse…then again asks the chicken or the egg…would this seasons off island timeline exist without Jacob’s influence/interference…or did Jacob’s influence lead to this path, taking the necessary events to continue.

    Remember when Locke and Sawyer were talking about interfering in the past?
    Sawyer couldn’t understand why Locke didn’t just interfere with his past self, tell him the right thing to do…Locke told him because he needed it…I think the losties NEED what happened in order to continue…

Leave a Reply