Ok since season 5 this has reeeeally annoyed me. Eloise is pregnant with him in ’77. So when Faraday comes to the island in ’04 he is 27… Looks a bit older than that to me! So i gave his pre-ageing to the fact that he works with radiation etc. as being around that for so long can cause you to look older than you are.

However.. In the Alt. timeline, he looks the same age as he does in the real timeline, even though he’s a musician and has no contact (that we know of) with radiation.

Is this a casting error or do you guys think there’s something more?

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They share one thing in common: they both want to kill Locke – one in the original timeline and one in the alternate one.

So maybe Cooper did all those bad things to Locke for the same reasons that Desmond is doing them in the alt timeline?

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Ok, so, just watched e12 of s06. Few thoughts’ve crossed my mind.

First of all; the 815’ers flashing back memories in the alternate reality. I would not go as far as calling it imaginary, quite yet, though. Why? Think about it in my way;

– It all starts with the losties crashing in 2004
– They stay on the island for god knows how long (three years, was it?), and then move the island through time. End up in the 70’ies. Some get off the island (Jack, Kate, etc..)
– They live in the 70’ies for three years, and are eventually reunited with Jack, Kate, Sayid and the rest of the losties returning, only to find out the island is moved in time.
– Then, Faraday finds out he wants to eliminate the plane ever crashing in 2004, by detonating a highly radioactive hydrogenbomb over the electromagnetic pocket. He succeeds. What happens?

1) They are thrown back to the correct year, on the island, beeing 2004/2007 (cant remember)
2) The plane never crashes, therefor creating a separate timeline.

Here’s whats boggeling me, though; it is obvious the losties on the island, and the ones in the separate timeline is entwined, as they have memories of the island. You guys remember course-correcting? The universe correcting when you try to alter what’s allready happened?
WHAT IF! What if the separate timeline is the universe trying to correct the fact that Jack and the others tried to stop the plane from ever crashing? Considering the fact most of Lost is based on true physics, we have to assume detonating an a-bomb over an electromagnetic pocket would make up for a hell-of-a-lot of energy. What if the universe course corrected all this energy in a separate timeline?

Small note to this; talking to my science teacher about this (masters degree in phsyics, with spec. in quantums and radioactivity), he made this example; If you go back in time, and kill Hitler, the timeline will split, and the people here in 2010 would not see anything of it. Why is that? What has happened, has happened.

I’m not willing to forget that sentance, just because they blew up an a-bomb, and are flashing “sideways”.

EDIT EDIT!
This is from an old theory of mine, where I suspected Locke had to be reborn.

To take it all further, I think I have a possible explenation on why Locke’s got to bring them back.
This is what Jesus said to Nicodemus to convince him of his holiness:

Jesus’ miracles have convinced Nicodemus that Jesus is sent from God.
In reply, Jesus declares, “I tell you the truth, no one can see the kingdom of God unless he is born again”

Someone clearly has to reborn to unveil the mystery, and I’m guessing its Locke!

It’s fun to be right! 😀

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I’ve seen a lot of people doubting the elements of the show that at least are supposed to appear “obvious” lately. Well, I believe that the writers are done messing with our heads. I think that, in season six, everything is what is appears. Jacob is good, MIB is evil, the Island is the cork, the alt. timeline is just an alt. timeline (I’m less sure on that, though), MIB is the Smoke Monster, and Charles Widmore is against MIB. Isn’t it possible that they’re done confusing us?

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We’ve found many questions when it comes to the detonation of Jughead and its connection with the 2007 jump as well as the alternate timeline. Luckily, I’ve done some pseudo-scientific pondering and have come up with some interesting ideas.
It starts in 2004, when the Oceanic 6 leave the Island and the wheel is pushed, knocking the Island off its time axis. It seems here that the wheel itself is in its own timestream, for it the Losties flashed to a time where the wheel was stable, they would’ve stopped flashing. Anyway, in the 70’s, when the flashes stopped, we’ll say that this left a link between the time periods due to the constancy of time in the wheel chamber. So, in 1977, they detonate Jughead. This is the critical moment. Anyone who knows the history of black holes and wormholes knows the theory that such things link to parallel worlds, or possible create them. Either a wormhole or black hole can form from the intense concentration of energy in one point. This is Jughead’s run-in with the electromagnetic pocket. At the moment of the explosion, an amazing thing happens. The energy of the explosion and the energy of the electromagnetic pocket combine to form a singularity, which creates a second timeline. This singularity actually pulls all of the Jughead energy with it into the alternate timeline, crashing the Island and killing Jacob and Not-Locke.
At this point, things change in the alternate timeline. Jacob does not touch anyone, and the energy (inspired by , great idea) actually causes young Jack’s appendix to contract appendicitis, causing him to have it removed. This affects his future memory (the young age, Island boom, and painkillers), causing him to forget for years.
Back in the original timeline, the Incident still occurs. However, the violent spacetime event under the Island twists the wheel’s time connection and sends the Losties back to 2007. Due to the nature of time travel, they should’ve also been sitting by the hatch for 30 years in between, but in the LOST universe, time travel happens in jumps, not smooth (albeit contorted and shrunken) temporal movements.
Back to 2004, alternate timeline. Jack and Rose are talking on the plane. The temporal link in the original universe at the time of the Jughead detonation left a scar here, causing Jack’s melded memory and the rougher-than-expected turbulence. Nothing stange here.
Now for the future. Imagine the timeline being like a road, with a curve off the side that eventually folds back. This will happen in 2007. The link between the timelines eventually pulls Jack, Kate, Hugo, Sayid, and Sun in the alternate timeline to the Ajira 319 flight. At the time it crashes in the original timeline, they hit the original timeline take its place, to later land in Guam. There they are greeted by Charles Widmore, who takes them aboard his submarine to the Island.
This theory is amatuerish, I admit, but I like it. It seems to make sense with what we’ve already seen. I have no clue if this will be right, but it’s interesting to think about.

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I think I read some time loops theories with similar ideas, but can’t remember who wrote them or where, so these ideas are only partially mine – more like I chose some pieces from various places and put them together to come up with my own little chaotic theory! Oh, additionally, my theory assumes Jacob is Aaron and MiB is David (no originality there -ha ha). Sorry for the length of the following!

Firstly, I wanted to start off with the bodies in the cave that Jack discovered in Season 1. I initially thought that these Adam and Eve bodies were a mother and father. I thought that MiB and Jacob were brothers (like the Jacob and Esau story from Judaism) and that these two bodies were their mother and father. Now that I’ve given in to the idea that Jacob is Aaron (I’m still not convinced) and MiB is possibly David, I NOW think that these bodies are still parents, however, not from the same set of parents. To clarify, I think that the male body is Jack’s and the female body is Claire’s. Remember when Hurley said something like “What if these bodies are ours?” It got me thinking..Jack is the one that discovered them, what if Jack just discovered his own dead body?! On a side note, I feel MiB and Jacob being brothers would be more poignant than them being cousins, but hey, I’m not the writer – moving on.

Now, I think that like a lot of watchers I assumed the alternate timeline was a result of the bomb explosion the Losties forced at the Dharma site in 1977. Following this logic, time should (but who knows – it’s not like time travel is an exact science!) have forked at the very second the bomb exploded if the bomb explosion did what the Losties expected it to. In this case, the new “prong” of the fork should be the alternate timeline. So, just to clarify a little, let’s assume time is depicted as a straight line. When the bomb went off in 1977, that point of the line should have two branches. One branch is what we are being shown with the Losties still on the island having survived the explosion (umm – I’m not a nuclear physicist, or bomb expert, but shouldn’t they all have died seeing as how they were all within a 200ft radius of the explosion??) and the other branch is the alternate timeline where the plane lands safely and Desmond was on the plane, etc. I assumed that this is what happened because Juliet said it worked. But I kind of had also assumed if it had worked as Jack thought it would, the Losties in 1977 would have ceased to exist and we would be seeing ONLY the alternate timeline versus two (one island timeline and one alternate).

So, to say the least, I was confused. Then Jack had the conversation over the phone with his mom asking when he got his appendix removed. If the timeline were in fact a Y shape, everything in Jack’s life until 1977 (until the fork in the line) should have been exactly the same in the alternate timeline as it was on the island timeline. In fact, because Jacob didn’t even meet Jack until he was already a surgeon, everything in his life in both time lines should theoretically be exactly the same until that point, as MiB said Jacob influenced all the decisions the candidates made (after touching them – or before as well? – this wasn’t clarified). Following the logic that Jack’s life should be the same except for those incidents affected by the island/Jacob, Jack’s appendix shouldn’t have been needed to be taken out until 2004 when Juliet took it out on the island timeline. So, in the alternate timeline we know that Jack had it taken out as a young boy, but on the island timeline, he lived it with it as a boy. So, now we see that Jack has two separate childhoods. This is contrary to the Y shaped timeline because the base of the Y should be exactly the same for both timelines… In fact, Hurley’s entire life until the time Jacob was supposed to touch him (in his 20s) should be the same too, but it’s not – he is no longer afraid of the numbers, etc. His whole personality seemed different…Locke had a relationship with his dad but was still in a wheelchair – what??
This suggested to me that the timeline isn’t a Y at all. In fact, it suggested that there are two distinct timelines..(depicted as two parallel lines – multiverse theory, anyone?). Maybe when Juliet said “it worked” she meant that the Losties now have a chance to get to this parallel timeline where everyone is happier (except why is Sayid not with Nadia?)

Now, what if, this alternate timeline is not a result of the bomb at all? The white flash that was shown when Juliet detonated the bomb flashed in such a way that I suspected the island “protected itself” and time jumped back to current time (2007?) before the bomb could do damage (although the donkey wheel was fixed by then, so this a weak point in my theory). In which case, what is the flashways timeline we’re seeing? What if this alternate timeline is not a result of the bomb, but is instead a PREVIOUS timeline? As in, what if Claire had Aaron and Jack had David..and they both grew up to be in their forties (this is the age they seemed to be while on the beach watching the Black Rock approach) in the “real” world off the island and then somehow David and Aaron came to the island in the future (let’s say 2040ish, just to give a date)…So in 2040, Aaron and David end up on the island, except the island is now existing in the past predating the crash of the Black Rock. Hence, they had the conversation which goes like: “They come, they fight, they corrupt..it always ends the same” – MiB. So now, Aaron and David are wayyyyy in the past and they exist on the island until 2004 where we see in Season 1, Oceanic 815 is brought to the island and our Losties get stranded there. If this is true, then Aaron (Jacob?) and David (MiB?) are responsible for their parents coming to the island! (This could explain why they are ageless – they won’t start aging until they catch up to 2040..) But why would they want them to come to the island? Specifically, Claire can have her baby in either timelin, but Jack is shown having a child only in the scenario where 815 doesn’t crash. Well, MAYBE this is WHY Jacob influenced Jack’s life – to prevent MiB’s birth. Maybe Jacob thought bringing Jack to the island would cause MiB to cease to exist, but instead, MiB did not just disappear or cease to exist, maybe MiB found his loophole instead, which is what allowed him to kill Jacob! As an entity surviving in a paradox (the paradox being how does MiB live if he was never born), maybe MiB no longer had to follow the “rules” and killed Jacob accordingly.

Now, how/why Aaron and David would end up on the island when it is at the bottom of the sea is anyone’s guess. I realize this idea has a lot of holes..I thought it was an interesting concept to entertain…children bringing parents to the island..and Jack finding his own dead body…however, I suspect if Jacob were in fact Aaron, he would have taken a greater interest in Claire (his mom)…but it seems instead MiB has taken an interest in Claire..perhaps manipulating the mother will influence the son (Jacob/Aaron)…Maybe MiB wants to help Claire find Aaron so he can kill Aaron so he can never grow up to be Jacob?

Additionally, I don’t understand what killing Jacob has really done to help MiB…I suppose we will understand if UnLocke ever leaves the island..

Last but not least, I am not convinced that MiB is the evil one and Jacob is the good one. Jacob as a “good” character has done a lot of things which can be viewed as selfish and not in the best interest of the Losties…hardly a characteristic of good. Of course, MiB seems to be killing left and right while in his smoke monster form, so both of these characters seem to have shades of grey. In fact, Jacob is being portrayed as the protector of the island, but it is Jacob who keeps bringing everyone to the island in the first place! MiB seems fed up with people and even asks Jacob on the beach, “Still trying to prove me wrong?” So it seems to me, Jacob brings people to the island to play out something Jacob is trying to prove to MiB. If anyone noticed, there is a book Jacob is reading while he is sitting on the bench waiting for Locke to fall out of the window and break his spine. I forget the name at the moment but I looked up the title of the book and read a short synopsis. It seems to me it is about humanity and trying to show that humanity does still have a capacity for good (correct me if I’m wrong). Even if Jacob were trying to prove something to MiB, it doesn’t explain why MiB is trapped on the island, etc. It would be funny if they simply placed a bet, “Hey MiB, you can’t leave until you can prove humanity is hopeless, and I’m gonna spend the next 300 years proving humanity CAN be salvaged..” Ha ha!

Now whatever role Richard plays in all this should be interesting…as I recall UnLocke said to him, “Nice to see you out of those chains Richard..” The only chains in the show I can remember are the ones on the Black Rock which appeared to be a slave ship..?

In a nutshell, I think that the alternate timeline is the first time the Losties live out their lives and then their children go to the island as adults and end up in the past, wait for their parents to crash in 2004, and seasons 1 – 5 was a showing of the second time they lived their lives, this time partially on the island…

Alright guys, sorry that this is so long, but I’d love to hear your thoughts..thanks!

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I’ve seen that not everyone fully understands whats going on in this season with the alternate time-line. It should be noted that calling it an alternate time-line is not necessarily accurate considering it takes away from the idea that this time-line is as real as our original time-line we watched. But it makes it easier to talk about when you have a name for it. Anyways, this article is to help clarify some of these concerns hopefully regarding this alternate time-line. I wrote an article on Course Correction last season but it has been lost since then. This one is a little different and delves into this season’s aspects of Course Correction and time-lines.

It is my opinion (and has been since the first episode of this season) that the point of this season is to show us how course correction works on large changes. That’s right, that little thing that Ms. Hawking brought up WAAAAAAY back in season 3 (Episode: Flashes Before Your Eyes). Basically what happens is Desmond goes back in time consciously and makes a different decision than the first time he lived this. He buys the engagement ring. Well Ms. Hawking can’t let this fly. She takes Desmond out and and tells him that he’s not supposed to buy the ring. She points out a man in red sneakers whom dies moments later. When Desmond asks her why she didn’t save him, she replies that it wouldn’t have mattered, that the universe has a way of course correcting, and that he would’ve died soon anyway. Since this episode they showed us course correction of something small through Desmond’s attempts to save Charlie. The universe just kept putting Charlie in situations where he had to die and Desmond kept saving him until Charlie accepted his fate.

Since the Charlie Incident the writers have mentioned course correction zero times and the general consensus on how changing things works is that since it didn’t happen you can’t make it happen now. Something must’ve prevented you from doing it because it was never done in the first place. This directly conflicts with the concept of course correction. Course correction implies that you can make changes but that they won’t remain for very long due to the universe’s balancing act.

Now the writers have reached this season and have asked the question, “Well OK the universe can course correct something small like someone living who was supposed to die. But, what would happen if something big were to occur?” For instance someone detonating an f-ing hydrogen bomb. Well here’s where it gets a little bit trickier. Obviously this will greatly impact more lives so more tweaks have to be made to get the altered time-line back on track.

The easiest way to describe Course correction would be to explain time as a line (as most do). Now let’s say that this line is our time-line or the series of events that are supposed to occur.

————————————————————————————>
(Our happy little unaltered “all-is-good” time-line…YAY!)

We can think of each of those dots as an event that is supposed to occur, due to fate. But what would happen if I went back in time and now knowing how these events are supposed to play out, I do something different? Well this wouldn’t alter the line of things that are supposed to happen especially considering in some sense they already have happened (at least for me). So they can’t just disappear into nonexistence. So how do I explain these new different actions happening? Well, what happens is a separate time-line splits off from the fate-accurate time-line (graphically shown below).

_____Altered Event
__________/————————–> (Ahh shit world’s gonna end Time-Line)
———————-/—————————————————-> (Fate-Accurate Time-Line)

According to course correction the universe doesn’t like it when this happens. In fact it will do whatever it can to purge this new time-line. It does this by merging the two time-lines at some point. In the case of something small such as Charlie Pace being alive in one Time-Line and not in the other it’s simple. The universe just has to kill Charlie Pace.

_________/————————\(—Course Correction
——————–/————————–\————————–> (Back on track Time-Line)

The problem now is that something has happened on a large scale that has impacted many peoples lives greatly. It’s much more difficult to merge these two time-lines now. In fact, I don’t see how they’re going to do it but hey they’re Lost writers and I’m not naïve enough to think I can anticipate any aspect of this show.

An important thing to note is that these two time-lines are one and the same time-line until an event is altered. Thus, the events that happen up until the H-Bomb goes off in the Fate-Accurate Time-Line are exactly the same events that happen in this Altered Time-Line. It might be easier to understand if I draw the time-line like this:

_____/———————> (Altered-Event Time-Line)
———-|
_____\———————> (Fate-Accurate Time-Line)

This just makes it harder to see that there is a series of events that are SUPPOSED to happen.

Hopefully this cleared up some questions about this season. Most likely, though, it raised even more. I didn’t dive into the issues with Hawking and Desmond being able to see the events that are supposed to happen like I did in my past post but I didn’t feel that necessary for now. If those issues come up in the comments so be it. Feel free to critique my post. I didn’t really do much proofreading and this was mostly stream of consciousness of what I know course correction to be.

Questions? Concerns? Statements?

-Benhamine

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I’m not sure if anyone has mentioned this, but no one has really talked about Sawyer in the alternate timeline. His whole point was to go down to Australia to kill the original Sawyer, which turned out not to be. Thus, he was pretty miserable on the original flight. In the ALT, he seems to be rather pleased with himself. Did he actually do the killing? Was he there for other issues? Did his parents’ murder-suicide even happen?

Thoughts?

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Ok a lot of people seem to believe theres going to be an Alt. Timeline(s). First of all I understood nothing about it and thought it was a ridiculous idea but, that aside, if it happens then i need to know whats going on.

Due to reading  A LOT of theories on it, Im pretty sure I understand almost everything. However, there is one thing I’m still not clear on..

When does the Alt. Timeline begin?

Does it start at the swan site? If so is it because the bomb didnt originally go off and my exploding it they caused a change in the future therefore making a new timeline?

Or does it happen some other time.

Also, I’m slightly confused as to why people think Sun, Lapidus, Ben etc landed in an Alt. Timeline.. You say its because you hear numbers being broadcasted but they were disabled years and years ago, so something is up, right?

But how can that be an Alt. Timeline because if it was indeed started at the Swan Site, then that hasn’t occured yet. So surely it started somewhere else..?

If someone could share some light on this that would be great.

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So, boom.

I think we can assume that the bomb went off (if it didn’t, that would be lame) and ‘the incident’ was averted. As Miles pointed out, it could be that the bomb detonating was ‘the incident’, but I think that this outcome would be a little lame as well. So the island and all those on it when the bomb exploded are gone. Where does that leave us?

This would mean no record of this episode in our linear history. That is, by only observing the events that we have record of in our timeline, there was never an island. But consider the possibility that along our straight, linear timeline are loops. Loops that leave our linear history but then join back to where they left off the linear path. For all intensive purposes, the events on the loop never happened. But they did. They happened in order that they never happened.

There is now no island, because it was blown up. But it was only blown up as a result of the actions of people who were only there due to ‘the incident’ and so the subsequent plane crash. Which, due to the bomb, didn’t happen. This has now created an infinite time loop, which in effect, doesn’t exist.

So how does Jacob fit into all of this? He’s from the future. He’s here to make sure that all these events occur so that the island never existed. Why? That remains to be told, but I’d imagine that the result of the island existing has disastrous effects in the future of the world. Jacob is able to influence actions and events as he can travel through time in a more controlled fashion due to the island’s time-travelling capabilities being further understood in the future. Remember Jacob sitting on the beach with the Black Rock in the distance. He’s been here, at various points, from the beginning.

I know there’s holes in my theory and questions unanswered, but I’d love to hear some feedback.

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This is my first post.

I took note during season 4 that Charlotte was clearly stated to have been born late in 1979, yet early in season 5, we see Daniel Faraday looking at a small red headed girl running by. Per other questions here, it seems to be universally accepted that Faraday, Burke and Sawyer make their last jump to 1974. How can Charlotte be at least 2-4 years of age in 1974 and simultaneously not be born until 1979? Did the writers make a mistake regarding Charlotte’s age, are we making assumptions about the year that the three “landed” with Dharma, or am I making the assumption that the young Charlotte is indeed Charlotte at all?

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