Widmore Can’t Return to ‘the island’
Charles Widmore tells John, he was the leader of his people for 30 years on ‘the island’. He also tells John that Ben tricked him into leaving. We know from Ben’s recent trials and tribulations, that returning to ‘the island’, is not an easy feat. Not, unless you have the benefit of Ms. Hawking’s assistance, and an almost similar way of reproducing the set of circumstances which brought you to ‘the island’ in the first place.
As Charles Widmore first went to ‘the island’ a very long time ago, reproducing a similar set of circumstances, might be next to impossible for him to accomplish. Therefore, he cannot return!
Whatever, the connection Charles had with ‘the island’, it was different than Ben’s. The connection Charles Widmore had with ‘the island’ and Jacob, was likely closer to the ‘real deal’. That is not to say, that things remained this way over the course of time. Something went amiss, and Ben succeeded in ‘turning the tables’ on Widmore.
Perhaps, neither man was the ‘rightful leader’. But, I do believe, Ben connived his way into his role of leadership, by inventing an inflated relationship with Jacob, and lied about this to Richard and ‘the others’. Ben was never destined to be its ‘rightful’ leader’. At best, Ben was always just, ‘The Man Behind the Curtain’. Calling all of the shots, and passing them off as ‘Jacob’s’ wishes. The ‘mark’, of a true con man.
Charles knows John Locke is destined to be the new leader. That is why he was there to meet and assist John when he arrived in Tunisia. Charles was trying to send the ‘rightful’ leader back to ‘the island’, to make sure ‘the wrong’ side doesn’t win. Unfortunately, Ben was onto him, and intercepted his and Abaddon’s attempts to right that wrong.
Somewhere along the line, both Ben & Widmore divided the sides and drew the battle lines. In the midst of all of this, our ‘losties’ were drawn in, by fate or destiny or by some other design.
Charles Widmore knows a war is coming. His intent, is to do what is in the best interest of winning this war, and that is for John Locke, to lead the battle with the help of the other ‘losties’. We must rest our faith in, whatever John and ‘the losties’ choose to do, that it will ultimately be the right choice.
While we are well aware, both Widmore and Ben each have a ‘dog in this race’, regardless of how self-serving that might be, Widmore cannot directly participate in it. He must remain on the outside, manipulating events, for this desired outcome.
John Locke is now in a position of advantage, because he has spoken with both men, and knows a bit more about them. As events start to play out, perhaps this insight will assist John in making the proper choices. Choices, that will serve the best interest of ‘the island’, rather than that of Ben and Widmore.
The fate of ‘the island’ and perhaps, mankind, rests upon the shoulders of John Locke, and ‘the losties’. They are the unlikely ‘pawns’ in a much larger game.
I dont really have much to say on this…because you pretty much covered my view. I still question true motive and intent of Ben and Charles, but Loce being true leader, Ben worming his way to the top, on the money. Well written, and now you got me thinking. I just HOPE John is the true leader and not just Ben and Charles gamepiece. Ive always been a Locke fan, but now more than ever. Its weird, all the other characters..I sort of expect tradgedy in one way or the other by the end. But for John Locke…I expect greatness.
I hope Locke is the true leader also… but I think mostly because I feel sorry for him. His life has pretty much sucked before the island and he needs something. I’m torn, however, between whether or not I actually THINK he is the leader. On the one hand it seems that Jacob wanted HIM specifically to turn the donkey wheel and there is the fact the he seemed so in tune with the island from the very beginning. On the other hand some of the things that originally made me think he was “special” now seem like by-products of him visiting Alpert when they were time jumping. Alpert visited Locke only because Locke told him too. Alpert also later tried to recruit him to a “science” camp while he was in high school. It will be interesting to see how this all unfolds, whether Locke is truly important or if he is simply an old man desperate to find something to make out of his life (God I hope he is special or it will be the saddest thing ever).
Well hopefully for ol’ Locke he will finally be able to start filtering some BS people give him, and stand on his own. Up until now he has been very trusting and easily manipulated, possibly his biggest downfall.
I can’t wait to hear Ben’s story of _why_ he killed Locke, which we all know is coming. Now whether Locke will buy the story …
NMB just made me think of something after my post … what if the point is that because Locke so desperately wants to become and be somebody, that he does? That destiny isn’t written, but formed by people with true desire.
I would think that Locke is going to assume that Ben was trying to get rid of him. This is the second time he has tried to do so… but whether or not Ben was truly trying to kill him, or just knew that he had to die for everyone to get back to the island is still up in the air.
Vtnerd, I really like that thought. I like to think that his destiny isn’t predetermined. His actions that will soon play out will determine whether or not he becomes the leader everyone says he is.
I think John is supposed to be the leader of the island but maybe not necessarily the “One True Leader”. I think the leadership of the island is meant to be shared between John and Jack. Both seem to be special but in different ways. John is the man of faith and he is constantly falling for other people
Thanks for all of your comments! It looks like we are all on the same page, when it comes to Locke!
We want him to succeed! And, after all he has been through, he is totally deserving of it!
vtnerd, that is an excellent idea about Locke wanting to be leader, so badly, that it actually happens.
That is referred to as the ‘laws of attraction’. I am fairly certain that ‘the island’ would be supporting of this principle, because of its ‘special properties’.
I can see how NMB’s statements inspired that line of thought!
highbrow, I like your thoughts on John and Jack having a ‘shared’ leadership role.
I have never looked at the light vs dark, as simply good vs evil. I don’t think it is quite that simple.
With any situation, there is always going to be the opposite side.
I am wondering if the ‘war’ comes down to one side believing faith will save ‘the island’, while the other side believes, that science will save it.
Perhaps, a marriage of the two sides, as in Jack and Locke, may be the winning combination.
Maybe that’s where we get the impression, that aside of Ben & Widmore, another side is at play.
I am so excited to watch tonight. I had a nightmare that I missed it and I don’t DVR, so…..yikes!
I really like the theory of Ben being the man behind the curtain. I have always thought he had an “impotent” air about him, with the whole Napoleon complex and the “Juliette is mine so I’ll kill Goodwin” ideas and stealing Alex. He’s a worm. He still scares the crap out of me…creepy!
Knowing that Locke is on one side and Ben on another, there’s still the question of what side Richard Alpert is on?
kittycarson, I am also excited about tonight’s episode! I think we’ll be getting into the ‘real meat’ of things now.
Ben just might be ‘the good guy’ he says he is, but is largely motivated by his ‘inner demons’.
He is the guy, you love to hate, and hate to love all wrapped up in one!
Be thankful, you didn’t dream about him! lol
eggotised1, Richard Alpert is definitely an ‘oddity’ in this mystery.
He seems to make many errors in judgment. He chooses a young Ben as leader, and then is swayed by the older John Locke, into believing he is the new ‘messiah’ of ‘the island’.
One would think, that out of anyone, Alpert would have his ‘finger’ on the pulse, but that doesn’t appear to be the case.
Hi db,
Couple of thoughts, it looks like Windmore is trying to get back to Island, he did send a freighter with some military people. Do you think that he can’t get back so he just wants to extract Ben? It does make sense as I’m sure Desmond has to get back to the Island the same way on a boat alone and this is why he was really not suppose to be on the 315 to begin with (everything happens for a reason) even though we are led to believe he was needed on the plane.
As for Richard, I don’t necessarily think he’s that special or knows more than Ben. When he met Locke back in the 50’s he seemed a bit surprised at the notion that Locke was from the future and that he was to meet Locke as a child. This bothers me, because I was thinking that Richard was from the Future and traveled to the past hence him not aging. Now I don’t know what to think about him.
Hi username, some good thoughts regarding Richard Alpert.
I am not sure what to make of him, at this point. His role on ‘the island’, is somewhat disconcerting to me.
Widmore falls under the same rule, as Ben and all of the other ‘losties’. They all needed to duplicate the events which brought them to ‘the island’ in the first place.
Ben scammed his way on #316, with Jin’s ring, as a proxy. And, who knows what he told Ms Hawking to convince her, why he needed to be on board.
As Widmore couldn’t go to ‘the island’ himself, so he sent the freighter to extract Ben. This alone, should convince people that he is unable to return.
I think that Richard Alpert is like John Locke. Dead… ish. I don’t think that John is going to be aging much from this point either.
You know highbrow, you just might be right about that! I haven’t been able to come up with any other scenario which explains Richard’s status.
I guess that also places Christian Sheppard in the same category!
All, of which opens up a whole new area for us to ponder.
No wonder the writers have continually joked about if they were to do a Season 7, it would be entitled ‘the zombie’ season!
I will be the first to nix the dead Richard theory. If he was dead, he would not have been able to leave the Island (see Locke as a boy, recruit Juliet, etc. I doubt Locke, Christian, or any other dead “zombies” will exist off the Island.
Thoughts???
lol username, I was joking about ‘the zombie season’!
I think the point I am trying to make, is that I have reached the conclusion, that Richard has to be in some other category, than ‘the others’. Not sure what that is.
Given his age to be very ‘old’, some other rules must apply to his status.
There’s been no evidence yet to suggest that people who the island resurrects cannot return to the real world. The island healed John’s paralysis and he’s able to leave the island without going back to the way he was before…
That is a good point, highbrow!
I recall quite a few seasons back, where the writers stated that being dead on ‘the island’ was a ‘relative’ term! I think that statement, is much more meaningful in this season.
With all we have seen and learned, I don’t think that might be as much of a stretch, as some might think!
I am keeping an open mind, because we haven’t seen all there is, at this point!
agreed, an open mind is needed with this show. I won’t disagree that dead people can’t appear off Island, we see this with Hurley talking to every dead person since Moses, lol. But in the physical form, in a form that others can touch, I can’t get my head around that being possible.
As for John being healed from not being able to walk, TIME corrected that another way by making sure he was back on that wheelchair, and there is no evidence that his leg would have healed to allow him to walk again. I think that was purposely done to let us know that you can’t get healed than leave the Island and be healed. Otherwise, people like Rose would leave and we know she doesn’t want to leave because she thinks her cancer will return.
Hi username, Great pick-up on John having to use the wheel-chair due to injuring his leg when he turned the FDW!
I was wondering if anyone else had made this connection! I think you are absolutely right!
I completely understand and agree with you on ‘the dead’ folk issue. It is hard to wrap it around your brain. Had I have heard this a season or two ago, I would have thought it completely out there.
Now, not so much! lol
How is the leader of DRAMA? My thought is that charles is leading DRAMA in 1977?
Before turning the wheel Ben said he couldn’t return if he did it. Maybe that’s what Widmore believes, too. Both of them are ‘others’.
John is something different.
I believe Christian did it, too, and then, like Locke, had to die to get back.
Ben & Widmore may not know about the dying backdoor (after hearing Locke had to die he seemed genuinely upset when he did, had he known you’d come ‘back’ he wouldn’t be so).
Hi waycurious, I think you make a good point about Christian, having possibly turned the FDW, in addition to Widmore, Ben and Locke.
Christian is, on ‘the island’ similarly to John Locke. Dead! So, that is a strong possibility!