Cataclysm and a path to alter fate
Submitted by Donald A. Salerno Jr.
Many have requested that I boil down my verbose ‘A Theory of Everything, A final solution’ into a simple framework that succinctly defines the final direction of the show. So here it is:
‘Time ‘it’s like a street. We can move forward on that street, we
can move in reverse, but we cannot ever create a new street. If we try
to do anything different, we will fail every time. Whatever happened
happened.‘ Daniel Faraday
The LOST Island is a place which encompasses all time at once and all
the points of its own historical time line converge. It’s a place
where literally the past, present and future coexist and a place where
the voices and ghosts of the future, can bleed into the past or
present and vice-versa. The future dead have warned that there will
be a cataclysm that will destroy the fabric of space-time and those
who know the future are trying to alter it.
Unfortunately, in the world of LOST there appear to be some very specific rules of time/fate:
1. Someone from the past (and only from the island itself) can
travel to the future off the Island. That person who travels from
the past to the future, now knowing the future is the only person that
can actually change the outcome of future events.
2. Since only a person from the past can change the past and alter
the future, fate will not allow any person from the past to actually
change anything and will trap them when they go back from the future
or kill them. (Jacob is very likely trapped in a time limbo)
3. A person from the future can travel to the past (like Faraday and possibly Richard Alpert, as well as our 1974 Losties), but cannot actually change anything in the past. This is because the
future has already compensated for anything they can or will do and
has course corrected for them traveling to the past and trying to make
any changes. ‘Whatever happened happened.’
I believe we will find that the ultimate goal of LOST is to figure out a way to get someone from the past with future knowledge to change an event in the past and thus change the outcome of the future:
As of this point, there appears to be only two possible routes:
1. A person who has left the island and exits to the future can come
back to the island but only if they are dead, and only at a point in
the past prior to their death. Because they arrive on the island
dead, they will not be trapped in limbo. Also, because they were
alive in that past time/fate must course correct and they must be
alive again when entering the past. However, they will still retain
memories of the future and thus be able to change those events.
2. There might be a way to transfer the consciousness/knowledge of
someone presently living in and having knowledge of the future to
their same body existing sometime in their past so that their present
mind now knows the events of the future and they can now work in the
past to change the events.
Hope now lies with three:
John Locke (Dead, but now on the island resurrected)
Desmond Hume (Has the unique ability to transfer consciousness)
Christian Sheppard (Possible prior Islander, returned dead and now resurrected and working with Jacob)
All of these individuals are an an unanticipated anomaly of the known set time line. The normal rules of fate and course correction do not apply to them. They are the ultimate wild cards and Widmore, Hawkins, Linus, Alpert and Jacob are all now leveraging these indivdials to bring about a different conclusion and a different outcome.
Will any one of these special individuals be able to modify something, just one important thing, that alters course and saves the universe? We shall know if what happened, happened and will always happen or if a single seemingly unstoppable, unchangeable time line can ever be altered.
brondar1, I don’t think it was a case of y ‘boiling down’ your verbose. Not for me anyway.
This actually sounds like a different theory, from what you initially posted! This is a theory, that I like very much, and could subscribe to. It has relevance and meaning.
There are a couple of minor questions, but nothing too significant. I have only given this a first read, and want to re-read it again, before commenting further.
Outstanding!
brondar1, I have just re-read your theory.
I would have to say that both options you present for changing the future will be applied. We already know Desmond has the abilities to transfer his consciousness.
Locke is back on ‘the island’, dead, but resurrected!
I firmly believe we are dealing with 4th dimensional time space, where past, present, and future co-exist. The evidence for this, are ‘the whispers’, which for me, ‘seal the deal’, in that regard.
Lastly, I believe Daniel Faraday is flat out wrong! If you have read any other theories on the site, about causation and retrocausation aka (cause and effect), you will know why I believe he is incorrect.
I have stated, Faraday has made too many mistakes, (major ones) for me to subscribe to the notion, he is completely accurate about his, “whatever happened, happened”, rhetoric.
Just my opinion!
I agree with you Faraday is wrong an I hope that the show will take a direction in opposition to him. I think the set up is that there is nothing that will change and the pay off in year six is that they do change something with a big reveal…I think in began with one simple phrase from the resurrected Christian Sheppard to John Locke: “tell my son I said hello”. This could be a simple thing that a past resurrected person does to change Jack Sheppard from playing out the role he was doomed to play out, to change him just enough to make a different choice with corrects the past for the future.
brondar1, this is precisely the move I am anticipating with Faraday!
The writers have been very clever with setting the audience up with this one! I think many people will be surprised!
I like the analogy with Jack! That simple line of “hello” really turned Jack’s head around!
Love how you put emphasis on the word ‘choice’! I know for some people that is a concept, which holds little meaning.
I happen to think, it is paramount to the story line!
I love this theory and it fits well with my line of thinking. In previous posts, I commented that Desmond is more then ‘psychic.’ I theorize his consciousness was transferred to the future (maybe by Farady in the same manner as Eloise) and he has knowledge of the future AND has the ability to remember things that are ‘changed’ in the past.
I also discussed the fact that he saved Charlie several times and this resulted in change because Charlie helped him in The Looking Glass. This had to change the future because it’s likely no one else there could have played ‘Good Vibrations’ on a key pad.
I think the theme of the show will be “Can we change our Destiny or is our Fate set in stone?”
I believe the plot will involve changing the past. Why else would ALL of them have to return? Any thoughts as to why they would all have to return to the island?
I think all have to return because all are connected in the time line in a way that they are the very reason the events unfold. One or a few of them is also the reason where the events can be changed. Since they are all connected to events that cause the cataclysm time/fate has course corrected to make sure all the players are at the island to complete their duties. Those in the know are using this information to change one important aspect and they know if they are all not there the aspect cannot be changed and fate will just find some way to course correct to the end game. Its like backgammon you need all the pieces to play but only one side can win.
Explian one thing to me. In rule one when you say…
“1. Someone from the past (and only from the island itself) can
travel to the future off the Island…”
Who are you referring to with the..
“and only from the island itself..”?
I hope not the only two we saw turn the wheel and travel to the future, because they would also happen to be two of the adults whose births we saw…off the island, making them not “from the island itself”…or am i missing something?
Well written, just curious of a few things.
Great response, I agree. Without all the players the future cannot be changed because it was something they ‘did,’ ‘didn’t do,’ or something they ‘should have done.’
I only came to that conclusion after all the emphasis placed on everyone returning. Hit the nail on the head, you should write a new theory everyday!
I mean emanating from the island not specifically a person being born on the Island. It is only from the Island itself that one can utilize the donkey to travel off the Island through the Tunisia portal exit to the off Island present or future. So only an individual who is physically on the Island can utilize the donkey wheel to go to the future. As far as we know in the world of LOST there is no other place on earth where time travel to the future is possible. With that being said I think we will find that RAY Sheppard, Christan Sheppard were born on the Island and both traveled off through the Donkey wheel. Jacks “tattoo says he walks among us but he is not of us” This is because he a descendant of people who were originally from the Island.
brondar1, I definitely like the thoughts of Jack’s tattoo meaning, he is one of the original descendants of ‘the island’.
The tatoo thing I like. Said the same thing yesterday in a baby theory, or Jack is the baby theory. That was one of my reasons to believe Jack could be the child. That and the fact that Christian has been there before it seems or at least has a relationship with the island.
The island being the only place to travel to the future may be true at the moment, but was not always so. Or is it that it is later and not yet…either way, we have seen time travel to the future somewhere else.
We are always talking about ‘which came first, the chicken or the egg’.
What if, the end is the beginning, and the beginning, is the new end!
I certainly wish your theory had received more ‘air’ time on the main page, in addition to the attention, it rightfully deserves!
I hope you continue to share your thoughts, views and opinions with us.
Don’t worry bro this theory has been picked up by at least 6 other LOST sites and is currently a feature fan theory on the Fuselage website and is also currently the 8th hottest theory on the Dark UFO LOST site. Also, my long version will be featured in the near future on lost.About.com by staff writer Bonnie Covel who really liked my theory. I have been getting some excellent feedback.
Who is bro?
Also, for this…
“1. A person who has left the island and exits to the future can come
back to the island but only if they are dead”
Are you saying Ben is dead?
There is one caveat to time travel on LOST that because of brevity I did not include.
Because Ben caused the donkey wheel to skip he only exited the island in the off island present which was about 10 months ahead of island time. He did not actually go to the future as it pertained to off island time. So what’s critical is that when Ben comes back that he does not travel far enough back in time to where by being from the past he can effect past events and change the future. I think we will find that he is on the hydra island sometime around 2005-2007 (about when he actually left) and not prior to that. Since he did not go to the past from when he left, he cannot change the time line and he does not get trapped in time. He was in a very small window to where he could get back safely.
I have a few theories that revolve around Ben, Locke and the other survivors. I think ALL of the 5/6 O6 members are in ’77, and Ben, Locke, and the other 316 survivors are in 2007.
But I do see it as Ben going to the
future. If he didnt, then who did?
I do agree with the part of…
“Widmore, Hawkins, Linus, Alpert and Jacob are all now leveraging these indivdials to bring about a different conclusion and a different outcome.”
Do you have an opinion of whether the past will truly be altered, or are you just going to let it play out.
I like your reasoning, and a few new ideas, but I have read a few theories, that have similarities to your thoughts. You have done a nice job selling these things. Very well written, I just am curious if a
more conclusive choice has been decided.
Remember the island runs at a different time rate than time running off the island, so while on the Island it was 2004 and the Donkey wheel takes Ben to Tunisia in 2005 he hasn’t necessarily traveled into the future because he did not travel beyond the the off Island run rate which was already in 2005 (if that make sense). Remember Ben spent a few years off the island protecting the oceanic six. Those who I believe traveled to the future from the island and could not come back would back unless dead.
Jacob (already trapped n a time limbo)
Ray Sheppard
Christian Sheppard
Charles Widmore
Eloise Hawkins
John Locke
Now one can travel off and on the island using the special coordinates as it takes them out to present time without any side affects.
I think the writers of LOST are going to push the envelope trying to convince us that whatever happened happened, but in the end there will be a shocking change of events that will actually change the time line. The change in the time line will also free Jacob. This is because a new time line is created by an anomaly. And since he could have not have ever effected any changes to this new time line time/fate will have to course correct and free him.
So you think that when 815 crashed, the island was already behind the real world time. Or was it because of Desmond turning the key that it fell behind. Im just curious. Dont take offense to this please, Im just grilling to see what the difference is between this and some others that ive read. Seriously, not trying to push buttons, just to understand more.
I agree with most of what you said, have said it myself. just being curious. Theres a lot to it and I feel I missed something.
Yes in fact I think we can be reasonably sure the island was stopped in 1996 and did not begin moving toward present time until locke did not press the button. Below is an excerpt from my very long “LOST a theory of everything: The Final Solution” that addresses this:
“When Ben realizes DHARMA has unearthed the time wheel and they can suspend the island in a single time frame and save the world, he hatches an evil plan. Knowing from Alpert
Donald A. Salerno Jr.
…who is this?
Donald A Salerno Jr is me…
The writer?
Yes sir, one and the same
Im not going to lie. I’ll at least test you on the sci-fi aspect of the show…but the faith side, lol…that should be your stage, no?
Im guessing you dont think Locke is the one we are looking for to become the true leader. Maybe expecting a twist.
What is your take on Aaron?
Yeah, Im going to be bugging you now. You may be the only professional anywhere close to these subjects (fiction writing and end of the world specialist [: ) that I get to drill, so bear with me please.
I’m just a fan like everyone else but understanding LOST is a lot like trying to understand bible prophecy, so I pattern my own solutions in a similar fashion. In my opinion the only reason Locke is special is because of the time skip Ben caused. This allowed Locke to travel to 1954 and tell Richard he was special and he would be their leader. Therefore Richard later gives Locke special knowledge that he needs to die and come back, thinking that Locke is somehow special since he appeared to him in the past at a time that ole donkey wheel had been buried for centuries and was still buried. I believe Christian was from the Island and left to come back dead. He failed and stayed in the future and had Jack who was supposed to be the important child. But he failed with Jack who became a man of Science. I believe Christian looked for an alternate route through Claire and Aaron now becomes important because Jack would never believe. However, time/fate intervenes and Christian although dead comes to the island in the past and is ressurected.
He begins to work with Jacob and may have made a crucial change in what was supposed to occur by having Locke tell Jack that he had said hello. This changes I believe how things were supposed to play out for Jack as he is now a man of faith and has to return to the island. But given all the red herrings the show throws us Aaron may still be vital to saving the future if it can be done…
I knew something was up. Grammer way too consistent, too well written, not just a playground for you here, is it? This is a writers biggest dream and worst nightmare rolled into one. So many lit references and amazing storytelling its inspiring. At the same time, using so many good ideas, from so many different walks of life…it sets a very high bar. You make some good points. Like I said, I do agree with much of it. Glance over a few of my recent theories, you may see some similarities. The comments usually have some good stuff, and I try to give some sort of “revelation” upon every one. Honestly, if you got a chance, I would appreciate some feedback from you on any of them.( the more recent ones pertain to this topic, but I have some “faith” ones, that could use some knowledgable criticism (positive or negative) to get an idea if I have made mistekes along the way.
But I guess this show goes against the fourth reason that revelation is relevant in our time ;]
at least it tests our patience getting there
Great conversation, AES and Brondar1. I really enjoy the aspects of faith, intertwined with the ‘science’ elements of the show. That is, after all, the real life dilemma, isn’t it?
I feel with what you have stated, brondar1, that Jack’s tattoos appear to have more relevance now, as this season has progressed. “He walks among us, but is not one of us”.
I do see, Jack’s triumph of character, as being one of the greatest challenges on Lost. ‘The Man of Science’, transforming into ‘The Man of Faith’.
Glad to hear your theory is receiving the attention it deserves, on this site and others.
I hope you will join us in future for some of our late night discussions/rants on the site. That seems to be the ‘magical hour’ when the creative juices, flow best.
You referred to me earlier on, as ‘bro’, but ‘sis’ in my case, might be more appropriate! lol No apologies required!
Ooooooooooooooh, bro! i was wonderingif we had a slang talking Desmond on our hands :]
A few questions that I have from reading this thread.
– When do we suppose, in island time as well as in off-island time, that Christian was on the island? We see Christian when Jack is a young child, getting beaten up. And we see him as a surgeon, for I’m not sure how many years. When does/did he have time for the island! Of course Locke only needed 108 days to become “important”, and since Christian took the Donkey Wheel exit as we presume, is it unlikely that there was a submarine for him to frequent off the island during his island time?
– We assume that Locke and Christian both turned the wheel, went to the future, died and then came back to the island to be resurrected. We have seen Locke on the island again, and he seems pretty normal. So how come Christian was so omnious and creepy? Was this another one of those red herrings that we see when we think the Others are the raised dead or something like that?
this is a good read, from start to all the comments
few questions, why do you believe ben is responsible for the 108 minute time loop? he seemed reasonably surprised by the whole swan when he was held captive even to the point of saying that he didn’t push the numbers?
even though i believe that the someone will be able to change fate, i posted a similar idea to that, i’m not going to surprised if the show ends in an open way where we don’t really know for sure. i’m starting to move towards an idea where the first show will end up being the last show. i still can’t wrap my head around the whole jack thing in the first episode. we can post theories, be proud of them, even convinced of them, but the truth is in the debate and the knowledge that the producers have encouraged us to acquire along the way.
Cappayne, think of it this way, If Christian was on the island for any length of time a)time differencial on the island could be the difference. He could have been there for years, and only days, weeks, or months of real time. b) this makes sense to why he, like Jack, kept flying from LA to sydney…hoping for a crash, or at least death in Australia to set up the scenario of the pilot.
username. I 100% agree that the producers have “control” of the show. All the knowledge of science, literature, and religion cannot make up for the control of a fictional storyline.
Thats actually why I became more interested upon learning brondar here is an author. With the understanding that all people (and writers) think in very different ways, he has an excellent understanding of end religion and really want to see if he can dissect the faith aspect of the show a little more for us.
This is obviously a very quality Theory and thanks for sharing. For me it screams Time Travel and that is boring me a little as far as the show goes not your theory which I’ve read both and enjoyed.
I think when you push or pull the FDW in order to come back there has to be a great personnel sacrifice. Lockes death, Whatever Ben did, and Christian death would be examples. As you know sacrifice is a major theme throughout the Bible and I think it relates here on our show. If this all were true I can’t see how they could explain this to the masses.
I got got cut off before I finished. I just think for peeps that aren’t reading 50 or so theories a day wont roll with this, But for the online audience awesome stuff. What are there 10-12 million watching and if your right they better have there ears on.
Teh technicalities will probably not be stressed upon, but maybe just given to satisfy OUR cravings. I think the big jump to a more sci-fi, 2nd half gives to us the writers are there to tell their story to the hardcore viewers more than the novice viewers.
Talk to someone who watches lost and doesnt go to sites on it. Ask them the signofigance of the statue. They probably wont even remember the big foot from earlier in the show. Lost I feel is available to be understood without the internet, no doubt. But the true gems of the show, they are meant for us. The hardcore, spend so much time that people think your weird on a tv show site, dissecting things never meant to be dissected, fans. The ones who try every day to be one step ahead. I do think this show is meant for us.
You changed my mind A.E.S and I thank you for your insight. I still want to purge up a little time travel right about now. And still not drinkin this koolaid, although it’s a great theory no question. Again thanks for a whole new insight A.E.S.
Oh and brondar1 when it turns out your right I will be the first to congratulate you right here. Also we will have to have a read of your book. Revelation is an incredible book in the Bible and extremely difficult, for me at least, to read threw.
Ben is a liar and he only tells what he needs to say to get the job done. He was aware of everything DARHMA was up to. HE had his own office in the Hydra Island in the old DHARMA station (in a cut scene he talks to his daughter from this office) This is the place Caesar was in after ajira crashed. He had his own people stashed in the underwater station jamming communications. He may have never pushed the button but I am sure he knew about it.
I did not introduce time travel, the producers did. It will all end this season and the last season will be character/faith centered much like the first season.
Brondar, I must say, I agree with half of what you said. I think the last season will be very faith and character based, but I think the show will introduce the relationship of timetravel/science, with faith and peoples perception of it. I believe the last episode or two will center around a miracle, most likely shown by the miracle man himself, John Locke. But even there, I believe the openness will be there. You see, regardless of timetravel, we have already seen faith take presedence over science on Lost. People are just too mysified by the timetravel to notice. John Locke and possibly Christian Shepard have been raised from the dead. No concience timetravel. It wouldnt be due to time discrepencies, otherwise Ben would have healed by this point, although I do predict a speedy recovery.
I find it odd, this misconception of faith/religion being lost on Lost is still in existence after some of the settings this year. The scenes in the church alone, were enough to show me, there is more than timetravel influencing the show this season. Ben told Jack a story of Thomas, which I feel has more meaning than some. And did you see the scene when Jack walked back in to get Ben…he was praying, or sitting very awkwardly if not. I lay Ben out on the chopping block, every chance I get. But for some reason, before the show ends, we all might sit back and say he was doing the greater good all along. His mission, whatever it may be, does indeed including doing whatever he has to, to succeed.
I think the science/faith battle will come down to the very end.
I have a some thoughts on the whole science vs faith elements of the show.
Long before science was mastered to any degree, people relied solely upon their faith to answer the mysteries of the Universe, life and God.
Science eventually evolves, and attempts to either prove or disprove the mysteries of the Universe, life and God.
I believe this was intended to be a good thing, overall, initially. However, people became less inclined to subscribe in faith, and relied more upon science for their answers. Consequently, this divided people, rather than uniting them.
I think the writers are attempting to provide us with a view of how the two co-exist.
While science can help substantiate faith, faith does not, nor has it ever required or needed scientific proof to instill unwavering belief in millions of people over the ages.
I think this is one of the most brilliant stories ever written, because it makes us all think about both aspects for further understanding.
My thoughts are similar to yours, AES. This battle will be right until the end.
brondar1 it’s not you that turns me off to the time travel situation It’s how the show presented it. I was all for TT But when they started skipping around I had a moment where I went, not good. i would have rather seen a more controlled type of travel that was very limited. Instead we were taken on this ride where people can leap around in time with what is essentially little effect on them except a little headache and nosebleed. again not good. But you have taken what was presented and ran with it, and made some sense out of it. iv’e been doing this for a couple years and Ive seen great ones come and go. Sometimes they hit the mark other times not so good.
As for science vs. faith. Is it funny to anyone that these to were pretty much connected from the beginning. It started with, who science just not to long ago voted the most influential science figure ever, Sir Issac Newton.
I had this whole statement on Newton wrote out and lost it. Anyway he is an interesting character to say the least. His book Philosopiee Naturalis Principia Mathematica published in 1687 is considered the most influential book in the history of science. And he was a big player in the church also. As were most scientist untill this century when there began a divide. Now don’t get me wrong Faith and Science have been struggling against each other for a long time but there was a time when the church itself produced Scientist.
Give Hawking time Smoke, give him time.
This is by far the best analysis I’ve read on the deeper meanings and mysteries of Lost. I am a rabid fan after watching all 4 seasons last summer for the first time. As I’ve posted on other sites, I think it’s the best television show ever, in all of TVs history! The combination of the writing, acting, scenery, direction, and storytelling techniques make it a masterpiece and a treasure.
That being said, I respectfully have a couple of questions on your theory, “Lost the final solution” quoted here on March 13, brodar. The first is how does Dharma’s unearthing of the time wheel save the world? Second, isn’t there a contradiction to this premise when you state that there is a “potential of anyone from Dharma causing the final destruction”? I’m confused, and maybe rightly so–is Dharma a force for good (saving the world) or evil (causing its destruction)?
The third question is on the point of Locke being “special” due to the time skip that Ben caused. Is this the time skip from Ben’s turning the wheel? If so, then how did Locke regain the use of his legs when 815 crashed, prior to the turning of the wheel?
I hope you can help me understand this, because I so agree with almost everything you say. One of my persistant theories is that neither Locke nor Ben is going to turn out to be the true leader of the island. I’ve consistently maintained that the Ray/Christian/Jack/Aaron bloodline holds the key to the past, present, and future of the island, and I’m so glad to read your comments on this.
Ditto your prediction, and the comments of others who’ve posted here, that the final season will revert back to the characters, and their faith vs. science and fate vs. destiny themes. The time traveling should be merely a prop in the artful exploration of these universal themes. I think too much time is expended in trying to sort out all the confusing time lines/loops, which are a distraction from the real issue, the age-old question about the human condition.
The religious aspects of the show are also incredibly important, much to the dismay of some. I’ve read posts on other sites where there is a great deal of angst over the fact that any religion, especially Christianity, is a pivotal part of the show. I say kudos to the writers who have drawn on this rich source of knowledge and allusion.
Finally, I agree that Ben, even after all his lying and manipulation, will ultimately be shown to be a force for good.
Sorry I misspelled your name, Brondar! That’s what I get for not re-reading before I hit the submit button!
imisscharlie
While i am not an expert and the writers can do whatever they want I will try and answer your questions…
The first is how does Dharma’s unearthing of the time wheel save the world?
My speculation is that Dharma builds the Swan to harness the energy of the Island and they develop to 108 minute protocol as an emergency reset. My belief is that it by hitting the button every 108 minutes the island is suspended it a single time frame. Therefore, if they know there is a cataclysm in 2008 but the island always resides say in 1996, the island will never progress to the time frame of the cataclysm. Theoretically, keeping it frozen in time would save the world.
Second, isn’t there a contradiction to this premise when you state that there is a “potential of anyone from Dharma causing the final destruction”? I’m confused, and maybe rightly so–is Dharma a force for good (saving the world) or evil (causing its destruction)?
I’m proposing that those in know understand that the events which are to occur comes out of DHARMA. That is why Ben committed the purge. With the island suspended and all of DHARMA dead he thought this guaranteed that the calamity could not occur. Sure DHARMA is a force for good, but something in their time experiments goes terribly wrong. What those in the know did not anticipate was that those who actually cause the problem come from the future into the DHARMA era. I believe it will be our losties now in 1974 that will bring about what all have been trying to stop (or prevent it). I do not think the event is intentional. It may be something as simple as our LOSTIES trying to use the Donkey wheel to get back, thus causing a paradox so large that the fabric of space time is ripped apart. What everyone is trying to do is change what they already know will occur.
The third question is on the point of Locke being “special” due to the time skip that Ben caused. Is this the time skip from Ben’s turning the wheel? If so, then how did Locke regain the use of his legs when 815 crashed, prior to the turning of the wheel?
The time skip was from Ben turning the wheel in such a way that it skipped and sent him outside into the present off island time. John Locke could walk because he landed on the island in a time frame prior to when he suffered the leg injury. Lets say on island time was 1996 when they all crashed. If that were the case Rose would not have cancer, Locke would not have been thrown out a window and Christian Sheppard would not be dead. Heck, if the Island is suspended in time going back every 108 minutes it would explain why that darn Hurley never dropped single a pound!!!