Yep, they’re in a ‘time loop’
Were you shocked when Sawyer saw Kate delivering Claire’s baby? There have been subtle hints from the writers since Lost began, which have caused us all to shake our heads in disbelief over what was going on.
One of the hints we received early on was Rousseau’s distress signal from the Radio Tower. This had been ‘looping’ for 16 years or iterating if you prefer.
Iteration means, the action or a process of iterating or repeating: as a procedure in which repetition of a sequence of operations yields results successively closer to a desired result.
This encompasses ‘the losties’ seemingly endless pursuit for redemption and change. Iteration accounts for the feelings of deja-vu we have witnessed from some characters and an overall feeling that they are repeating the same circumstances until they get it right, or have significantly changed the outcome.
An example of this was with Charlie. In the beginning, Charlie tells Jack, ‘I don’t swim’, when Jack asks him to swim out to save the drowning victim. Later on, Charlie claims he could swim by asking Desmond, why he didn’t allow him to save Claire. We are then shown a ‘flashback’ of Charlie’s dad teaching him to swim, and in the end see Charlie (the accomplished swimmer), dive down to TLG and save the day.
The writers were quite brilliant in showing us Halliwax playing the Willie Nelson record. The record skipping was referring to ‘the island’ skipping in time.
Farraday declares you cannot change anything in the past, which in effect is a ‘paradox’. The paradox that most accurately depicts ‘the losties’, is the Predestination Paradox. This exists when a time traveller is caught in a loop of events that ‘predestines’ or ‘predates’ them to travel back in time.
Because of the possibility of influencing the past while time traveling, one way of explaining why history doesn’t change, is by saying that whatever has happened was meant to happen. A time traveller attempting to alter the past in this model, intentionally or not, would only be fulfilling their role in creating history as we know it, not changing it! Or, that the time-traveller’s personal knowledge of history already includes their future travels to their own experience of the past. Think, ‘The Butterfly Effect’.
The time traveller’s personal knowledge of history already includes their future travels to their own experience of the past. Effectively, it means this; the time traveller is in the past, which means they were in the past before. Therefore, their presence is vital to the future, and they do something that causes the future to occur the same way that their knowledge of the future has already happened.
I believe ‘the whispers’ are actually conversations picked up by those who are ‘looping’.
I will refer to them, as ‘the watchers’. Why is this happening? I don’t have a clue!
nice work dabs. Not to..umm..reiterate what you did..but i twisted my own loopdeloop theory on the subject. Love the examples you use that are used as a foreshadowing method of sort.
AES, glad you like it, you helped inspire it!
Read your theory, and loved the ‘twist’!
Yep.
I like how the writers are giving Sawyer the opportunities to play the other side of what it appears that Ben, the O6, Locke, etc. are all trying for.
Sawyer’s “What’s done is done” attitude is a really interesting counterbalance to some of the other efforts (themes, even) of trying to undo or redo what was done in order for things to turn out as they were supposed to.
I like this theory because it allows for the characters to have a more active role in what is happening instead of it being solely about the powers/issues/scientific aspects of timeloop, time travel, etc.
Nice one!
I couldn’t agree with you more on Sawyer, kimberly. They are always showing us the two sides of everything. Light and dark!
I also love the writers story telling methods.
I also wanted to make mention of the teddy bears you wrote about. This is another very subtle way the writers are providing clues for us. Can’t wait to learn more about the children.
Thanks for your comment.
I hope it is okay to jump in here?!
Just wanted to say I really think the comment about the whispers and the Losties is very pertinent. The first thing I thought of when I heard Sawyer say he had seen Kate was the whispers. I think this ties things together nicely although I know a lot of folks don’t like the time travel aspects of the show.
Your second to last paragraph is the killer. I firmly believe that the Losties have skipped back in to the past BECAUSE they were meant to. They were meant to because they already lived through that time.
Hi sawyerismybabydaddy, the discussion is as important as the theory, if not moreso. All critiques and thoughts are welcome.
I think many people have a difficult time embracing the ‘time’ elements of the show. I thought I was going to hate it. But, the writers have done such a brilliant job of telling the story.
Thanks for your comment
I don’t think their in a time “loop” they’ve travelled to the past, many different times in the past. and this one time it happened to be around 2004, and they happened to be near Kate and Claire. This doesn’t mean their in a time loop at all to me, this just means thier skipping around in the time, landing in different times in the past. Thats not looping….thats time travelling…..
Hi Bailey, I can understand what you’re saying. There are MANY different elements at play here. Not just time-looping.
If you can provide me with an explanation substantiating your claims, as to why you believe it isn’t, and tie in all of the elements and explanations for what has been occurring, I’d be happy to hear them.
Thanks for your comment!
bailey..i agree to an extent. Again, i have to go with perception. The part w/ sawyer watching claire have the baby might not be the best example, but a relic of whats to come. If he saw himself in past, it may play more of a loop scenario.
arthurwatts99, The episode aired in North America last night, therefore anything discussed is not considered a ‘spoiler’ by the Admin of this site.
Most people overseas avoid Lost websites until after the episodes air in their area.
I suggest if you have any problems with the way the Admin has set out the policies of the site, you direct any further comments to her.
It’s unfortunate you were spoiled. I am only one member, who is posting theories according to the rules set out by the Admin.
Hi Dabs, no i’m not going to provide and explanation substantiating your claims, as to why I believe it isn
arthurwatts – wow, whine much? it’s not a spoiler, as the episode aired last night and now here we are discussing it. If you’re just figuring out now that it airs a few days late in the UK, thats your problem, and certainly doesn’t mean we’ve posted spoilers.
AES – but why does that make it a time loop situation? He’s simply travelled randomly to 2004 (after going to many other times first) and happened to see himself. It was the first time he had been back to that time, he’s not going to repeatedly go back and relive that moment, so why is it consiered a time loop?
sorry i know i’m disagreeing with everyone on this one lol but i’m open to changing my opinion, i just don’t understand it yet….
Bailey1227, No problem at all. lol I understand just how difficult it is to take in all of the elements that are happening. i totally appreciate where you’re coming from.
AES is very good at explaining the different dynamics.
I have just resigned myself to keeping an open mind to anything on Lost.
For nearly 2 years, I said ‘there was NO time travel’ in Lost. Now look at what I’m posting! lol
arthurwatte- yes i said whine. yes it is up to you to avoid theorys and sites after the show has aired in north america because it certainly isn’t up to those who live here and watched it when it aired. and i am more then confident that the admin will handle this.
as a new member myself, i was dissapointed to come on to read and discuss last nights episode and have the comments filled with someone complaining about us not putting *spoiler* in the titles when we discuss last nights episode.
and window warrior?!? just call me ‘WW’ from now on 🙂
bailey, i swear ill get back to our discussion. 1st off..I SPECIFICALLY ASKED ADMIN ABOUT DISCUSSING EPISODES IMMEDIATLY AFTER AIRING..WEEKS AGO. AND MY REPLY WAS TO TRY TO BE CONCIENSCIOUS, BUT OVERSEAERS SHOULD KNOW BETTER THAN LOOK. WHAT DO YOU WANT US TO DO? NOT POST TILL A WEEK LATER. THEN YOUR THEORY COULD BE BLOWN. NOTHING WRONG WAS DONE HERE IN MY EYES
Dabs- thanks for understanding 🙂 i’m starting to think that maybe i just have the wrong idea of the definition of “time looping”, so i’m gunna do some more reading…gotta say though, i’m loving all thi stime travel stuff, LOST just keeps getting better and better!
emzi herself is overseas and she is admin and avoids until her episode airs there. Check the questions forum for more info..
Bailey1227, Of course I understand. That is what the discussion is all about once a theory is posted. To get ALL thoughts out there.
I am loving all aspects of the time travel, myself.
I look forward to your input anytime, good, bad or otherwise.
bailey… Read my theory on twisted loops and whispers…it may help
Good theory Dab. I also think maybe we need to clarify what you mean by time looping. I think my understanding is similar to Bailey’s understanding in that in what I consider a time loop, events occur to a certain point then everything goes back to a specific point in time, i.e. the plane crash.
Hi Locko, I basically avoided any in depth description of time-looping, on purpose.
I didn’t feel I had enough details to provide. What I did do, was provide a dictionary meaning to what an iteration is.
In addition to that, provided some background information and ONE description of time-looping, that I personally thought fit.
I found value in the research I did. It is not to say that this is exactly what is occurring, but one interpretation of it.
This may seem off topic, but I thought I would put it out there anyways, as it relates to the scene mentioned above with Kate aand Sawyer.
About Sawyer –
I like the idea that this guy is being given the tour of all the significant events he missed out on while he was sitting on a beach with his nose in a book.
From a character stand-point, Sawyer had been one of the least involved or caring people on the show. He is also one of the character who has grown the most every time he opens up to experiences.
First Kate takes him outside of himself and opens him up emotionally. Then Hurley further forces him to break through his cocoon and reach out. Then Locke puts him in the situation where he fulfills his lifelong quest for revenge and confronts him with the questions of ‘What’s Next?’ or better yet ‘What’s Left?’
Now it seems the island itself is reaching out and giving him the tour. The loop theory would point to where his character arc is going…
I think its more than a tour…redemption, redemtion, redemption
Andre7, You’ve touched on a character that is near and dear to my heart. Sawyer is the most clear cut case of redemption on Lost, IMO.
He was so wounded, flawed and vulnerable and undoubtedly the most sympathetic character. Traumatized in early childhood.
You have depicted his transition to redemption accurately.
How could one not feel for him when he killed Cooper. It tore me up just watching him. I hated Locke for making him do it, even though I logically understood it served his path for his betterment.
AES, What I love so much about Lost, is that everyone can be redeemed. Watching the characters transition is amazing!
Redemption IS about changing the past. Re-living the events, making and altering the changes each time you re-live them.
This is why I will cling to “The Butterfly Effect”, as being somewhat applicable. I think it’s undeniable this is occurring in Lost. Repeating the past until the desired is achieved.
correct dabs. Thats exactly what ive been trying to say. It takes one word/vision anything that seems so miniscule, to make a life/world changing effect
AES, I love your thought process, and I KNOW you are correct!
What a beautiful statement!
I’m afraid I have to agree with the anti-time loopers.
A time loop to me suggests that they are re-living events in the same body (ie. only one of them exsists) and that they have no prior memory of events that have happened after that point that they’re re-living. A time loop also suggests that they’re re-living the same events over and over again.
What’s happening in Lost is that a group of people are being sent to different points in time. When they’re sent back to a time where they’ve already been, they’re not in the same body as they were before (ie. 2 of them exsists in that time), and they can remember everything that has happened after that point in time.
They’re just travelling to different times and sometimes they co-exsist with their past selves, but their past selves are unaware of their exsistence so to me, it isn’t a loop, just a travel in time.
Hope that makes sense 🙂
Hi emzi, your explanation is supberb and understood. I guess it’s one of those things that boils down to perception.
I realize this is a subject which will be hotly debated until it is actually verified for us. I still stand by my theory, based upon my research of time looping.
It is as follows: (from Wikipedia)
A time loop or temporal loop is a common plot device in science fiction (especially in universes where time travel is commonplace) in which time runs normally for a set period (usually a day or a few hours) but then skips back like a broken record. When the time loop “resets”, the memories of most characters are reset (i.e. they forget all that happened). This situation resembles the mythological punishment of Sisyphus, condemned to repeatedly push a stone uphill only to have it roll back down once he reached the top, and Prometheus, condemned to have his liver torn out and eaten by an eagle each morning. The plot is advanced, however, by having one or more central characters retain their memory or become aware of the loop through déjà vu.